mele.nani commented : If we look at what has happened to Hawaii perhaps the Thai laws can be seen in some perspective. Hawaii was a kingdom and a monarchy. It was self sustaining. Conservation and proper respect for natural resources was vital to survival so it was embedded into the culture. It was not a perfect world but no place is perfect. After Western contact, more and more of the land was taken over by white men. They brought in commerce, trade, new materials and many activities which made Honolulu a bustling city. They also brought disease that decimated the population. The missionaries came and took power. They rationalized it by saying the heathens needed to know Christ and that the antiquated ancient laws that protected the land and water rights were inhibiting the growth of business. Thus came the overthrow of the Hawaiian Kingdom with the use of US military forces. Hawaiians have been degraded and driven off the lands. Their lifestyles that depended on gathering, farming and hunting were replaced by industry. This is progress? Who did it serve? Yes. There were also good things brought here. If the Hawaiian nation still controlled the land and water, Hawaii would be a thriving community based on Hawaiian values. Hawaiians were an inclusive Kingdom. Many farang were citizens of Hawaii. These very citizens, who changed the laws to introduce the concept of private ownership of lands were the ones to overthrow the monarchy and lock Queen Liliuokalani in prison. Sugar barons tried to "employ" Hawaiians by tying them up like oxen to pull wagons. They built clubs exclusive only to whites, they ruled the land. Hawaiian became servants in their own country. Other nationalities came here as servants, contract workers to serve farangs. Grumble all you like but Thailand is wise to keep control of its resources. If you want another analogy look at the Native American Indians. There is a sad history there. What about New Zealand Maoris and Australian Aborigines? People have lost their land, culture, and dignity because of opportunistic greed. I am not saying you are all opportunistic, but you are in Thailand for reasons. Only you know what they are. Make a difference rather than complaining that the laws should change. You want the laws to change so that they suit you. You want things to be structured to serve your needs. Thailand should control ownership of lands, culture and religion or Thais will be foreigners in their own country. You can help. Educate your children and help the country out of its poverty, generation by generation. Be mindful of your actions. You can take ownership of your place in communities by participating in the empowerment of the poor.

Isaannative commented : [quote="mele.nani":3ixa5e24]If we look at what has happened to Hawaii perhaps the Thai laws can be seen in some perspective. Hawaii was a kingdom and a monarchy. It was self sustaining. Conservation and proper respect for natural resources was vital to survival so it was embedded into the culture. It was not a perfect world but no place is perfect. After Western contact, more and more of the land was taken over by white men. They brought in commerce, trade, new materials and many activities which made Honolulu a bustling city. They also brought disease that decimated the population. The missionaries came and took power. They rationalized it by saying the heathens needed to know Christ and that the antiquated ancient laws that protected the land and water rights were inhibiting the growth of business. Thus came the overthrow of the Hawaiian Kingdom with the use of US military forces. Hawaiians have been degraded and driven off the lands. Their lifestyles that depended on gathering, farming and hunting were replaced by industry. This is progress? Who did it serve? Yes. There were also good things brought here. If the Hawaiian nation still controlled the land and water, Hawaii would be a thriving community based on Hawaiian values. Hawaiians were an inclusive Kingdom. Many farang were citizens of Hawaii. These very citizens, who changed the laws to introduce the concept of private ownership of lands were the ones to overthrow the monarchy and lock Queen Liliuokalani in prison. Sugar barons tried to "employ" Hawaiians by tying them up like oxen to pull wagons. They built clubs exclusive only to whites, they ruled the land. Hawaiian became servants in their own country. Other nationalities came here as servants, contract workers to serve farangs. Grumble all you like but Thailand is wise to keep control of its resources. If you want another analogy look at the Native American Indians. There is a sad history there. What about New Zealand Maoris and Australian Aborigines? People have lost their land, culture, and dignity because of opportunistic greed. I am not saying you are all opportunistic, but you are in Thailand for reasons. Only you know what they are. Make a difference rather than complaining that the laws should change. You want the laws to change so that they suit you. You want things to be structured to serve your needs. Thailand should control ownership of lands, culture and religion or Thais will be foreigners in their own country. You can help. Educate your children and help the country out of its poverty, generation by generation. Be mindful of your actions. You can take ownership of your place in communities by participating in the empowerment of the poor.[/quote:3ixa5e24] Dear Mele.nani, Your above comments are very well written. Thank you. Thais should not end up like the New Zealand Maoris, Australian Aborigines, Hawaiian natives, American Indians & South African Natives. Become servants in their own mother land. You are so right to say Farangs want the laws to change so that they suit them and things to be structured to serve their needs. But Farangs will never admit this is true. They think this world is created for others people to serves them.

sundayjam commented : [quote="singpurdonki":3cnn6r0s]sawadee mele.nani a very good post indeed! i thought hawaii was "alloha" with a few dancing girls and flowers in their hair. what an eye opener for me, thank you. these christian missionaries are not there just to preach only ? you mean they really took over the running of the gov of hawaii and not some other yankees ? (who came after them) US do have the indian reservations, run by native indians, with casinos, brooze, hookering, drugs. any help for the poor and destitude indians in the reservations by the reservations? do native hawaiian have any special rights in hawaii? sure glad to hear from you... in any posts [/quote:3cnn6r0s] Be careful of hearsay history. Hawaii was united by a king that exploited Western technology. Subsequent Hawaiian monarcies exploited their own subjects to increase the grandeur of their now European style kingdom. The first queen of these united island kingdoms converted to Christianity as it served herself and her people to do so. The father of modern China, Dr.Sun Yat Sen was educated at Iolani, an Anglican school established in the islands at the request of the king and queen of Hawaii. The Iolani schools are still prominent educators of Hawaii's children. A native Hawaiian trust owns and operates the RICHEST private school in the USA, Kamehameha. It's soul purpose is to provide the best education for all native Hawaiian children. Consequently, native Hawaiians are both economically and politically powerful.

Anonymous commented : Colin I am glad to see there are some men out there who think with their heads. Just because Thailand has a "custom" there is no need to follow it if the custom is stupid or will involve the loss of the assets you worked so hard for. I have a friend from CA who fell in love with a Thai girl that he met on his first visit to Thailand. She was in a bar playing pool. She said it was her first night out in three years as she was tending to her boyfriend who was involved in a motorcycle accident (he supposedly is a quad). Of course he fell in love the first night. Later on he came into a great deal of money when his father, who owned two condos in Hawaii died and left him the property. He promptly gave his girlfriend $10,000 USD saying to me, "Isn't she sweet. She said she would give it back to me if we broke up!!!" Also, in the due course of this romance she supposedly became pregnant after he had returned to the US. He promptly dished out a large sum of money to get the abortion and pay for her other expenses (plus pain and suffering). Was she pregnant??? Up to you to speculate... Oh, and did I mention she was a good pool player? I wonder where she learned that?

Anonymous commented : Professor quoted ........" I notice how some Thai people here in the U.S. will wear jackets in the hot summertime and don't like convertabile cars.(LOL)..." ..................................................... Too bad that you didn't get to see the other Thais in other parts of the U.S. ( Florida, Key West, Hawaii ?) who always wear ( nice tailored) Tank-Tops with walking shorts. Our cars have sun-roofed ..The last one was a convertabled. We have the same motto as the late billionair Greek shipping tycoon - Aristotle Onassis, once claimed...... " Tan means you can afford where the sun is."

Anonymous commented : Rad. Do you known that Canada has socialized healthcare system like in Thailand? If you are not comfortable in Thailand or in Idaho, Idaho is in the American heartland. These people do not give a nutcracker about foreigners. In their views, foreigners came to USA because Americans and America are better than their own homelands. Canada is more rural than USA unless you are living in the urban area, and Canada is many times colder than USA. It seemed like you are a urbanited person. You might considering finding American urban area with high population of Asians like Chineses and Vietnameses. San Francisco is an example beside New York, Houston, or Hawaii. US west coast cities will have the highest Chineses, Vietnameses, and Japaneses. Thais are mostly highest in LA, NY, and Florida.